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    1. Member Elite_Deforce's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 01:41 PM #76
      Quote Originally Posted by Samson View Post
      All fair points. You seem to go through cars quite quickly though, so assuming you get a normal Dodge product, it'll likely be good for 2-3 years (though you've proven to have a certain brand of luck when it comes to cars). And hey, if you do go that route and it turns out to be another POS, at least you'll entertain all of us. It's not like a Golf R or STI have a reputation for trouble-free ownership experiences either, so I'd keep that in mind. It's a tough one though, especially with the manual preference.

      A fast, under-the-radar option is a Q50 3.0t Sport (300hp), but it's auto only. ~$40k new though.
      A Q50 would look baller sitting in a rich client's driveway, though.
      Quote Originally Posted by Elite_Deforce View Post
      Panache, bruh.
      Quote Originally Posted by Ernie McCracken View Post
      I don't trust the judgment of anyone who likes black wheels.
      Quote Originally Posted by BRealistic View Post
      I find it ironic that long time Euro brand fans would assume long term reliability issues would destroy any love of a unique product.

    2. Member Ross1013's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:01 PM #77
      Quote Originally Posted by Slipstream View Post
      The WRX is just as capable of high-speed runs and maneuvers and is only a few hp down on the STI (268 vs. 300), yet it comes with no spoiler as standard. If the wing is essential wouldn't all performance Imprezas come equipped with it?

      I get your point, but swapping to a subtle wing has far less impact on performance than something like an airbag suspension or stretched tires. It's a reasonable trade-off IMO.
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      SUBARU SELLS THE CAR, FROM THE FACTORY, WITHOUT THE WING. Nobody is taking it off.

      And the performance difference, particularly at street legal speeds, is absolutely negligible if not nonexistent.
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      The. Car. Comes. From. The. Factory. Without. The. Wing.

      And the WRX, which puts out nearly the same amount of power (it's only about 10-12whp short on dynos) has the lip spoiler. It also has the same top speed.

      The wing does have a function, yes. But let's not act like it's the airbrake on a Bugatti Veyron here.
      So basically the wing is about as useful as the rear brakes on a modern car. Might as well ditch them all for that clean look. Lulz

      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      I do. On a weekly basis. I manage the personal affairs of wealthy people for a living. I frequently need to drive to their house, ring the bell at their front gate (where they see me driving in my car), and then park in their front driveway. I need something that doesn't scream "LOOK AT ME, I"M A KID WHO LIKES BE RECKLESS AND DRIVE FAST."
      Then I wouldn't get a WRX/STI or Focus RS, period.
      Past: '06 Accord V6, '95 Taurus SHO, '01 ITR, '98 Civic HX CVT

      Quote Originally Posted by jamerican1
      Dude, you know you're like the opposite of a purist, right?

    3. 04-17-2017 02:07 PM #78
      Ross...give it up on the STI wing, dude.

      Back on topic: Infiniti is practically giving away Q50 RedSport 400s. All you need to do is debadge it and nobody would be any the wiser, and I would call that nice and understated.
      Matt
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    4. Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:11 PM #79
      Quote Originally Posted by Maximum_Download View Post

      Back on topic: Infiniti is practically giving away Q50 RedSport 400s. All you need to do is debadge it and nobody would be any the wiser, and I would call that nice and understated.
      I actually test drove one of these like 1.5 months ago when another TCLer bought one.

      The engine is a gem. But I really didn't like the way the car drove. It had the famous Q50 zero-feels steering. Didn't corner very flat. Not a huge fan of the looks of it.

      And my local dealer was being sheistery, so I would need to fly to CA to get one for a decent price. It just didn't win me over.

      But otherwise a good suggestion!

    5. Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:12 PM #80
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      So basically the wing is about as useful as the rear brakes on a modern car. Might as well ditch them all for that clean look. Lulz



      Then I wouldn't get a WRX/STI or Focus RS, period.
      There's no need to bring Hawc into a (semi-)respectable thread like this.

      And I am towing a thin line on the STI. I think black or grey with no wing looks fine.

      Bright blue with a huge wing, however, is a no-no for what I need the car for. EDIT: It would look like I was trying to hard.
      Last edited by SchnellFowVay; 04-17-2017 at 02:15 PM.

    6. Member Samson's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:22 PM #81
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      I actually test drove one of these like 1.5 months ago when another TCLer bought one.

      The engine is a gem. But I really didn't like the way the car drove. It had the famous Q50 zero-feels steering. Didn't corner very flat. Not a huge fan of the looks of it.

      And my local dealer was being sheistery, so I would need to fly to CA to get one for a decent price. It just didn't win me over.

      But otherwise a good suggestion!
      If you don't like it you don't like it, but did you drive a DAS (2?) car or a normal, EPS car? I drove a Q50 S Hybrid recently, and the standard DAS on that was certainly strange to experience. Even though the hybrid is a really neat, fast car, the steering was probably enough to keep me away.

      What about a lightly-used 335i M-Sport? Those are under $40k.

    7. Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:31 PM #82
      Quote Originally Posted by Samson View Post

      What about a lightly-used 335i M-Sport? Those are under $40k.
      I am steering clear of BMWs as of now. I don't want N54/5 headaches, and I have already owned them in the past.

      I would love an F80 M3, but I don't think that it's in the cards at the moment.

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      04-17-2017 02:31 PM #83
      Quote Originally Posted by Elite_Deforce View Post
      Interesting claim. So you're telling me if I pull up next to an Accord in my new Lamborghini Aventador with Akrapovic exhaust and neon green paint, people will just ignore it cause it has 4 wheels and is sitting at a light so it's just a car right?
      Yes, because a supercar is a great comparison with a very boxy and ho-hum looking 4 door sedan, wing or no wing. Don't be obtuse.

      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      I do. On a weekly basis. I manage the personal affairs of wealthy people for a living. I frequently need to drive to their house, ring the bell at their front gate (where they see me driving in my car), and then park in their front driveway. I need something that doesn't scream "LOOK AT ME, I"M A KID WHO LIKES BE RECKLESS AND DRIVE FAST."
      Fair enough

    9. Member chuckster1's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:35 PM #84
      Quote Originally Posted by Hostile View Post
      How many threads do you need to make about your next car?
      Because we all know this will not end well.
      Quote Originally Posted by GoHomePossum View Post
      See? You have to relax before you can completely take in all of TCL's magic.

    10. Member Ross1013's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:38 PM #85
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      I am steering clear of BMWs as of now. I don't want N54/5 headaches, and I have already owned them in the past.

      I would love an F80 M3, but I don't think that it's in the cards at the moment.
      In all seriousness, a 340 M-sport would fit pretty well here.

      Golf R works as I and others have stated.

      But if you want a performance car that needs to cut a low profile while still being bad-ass, there aren't a ton of options outside of that. Audi S3? S4? C43?
      Past: '06 Accord V6, '95 Taurus SHO, '01 ITR, '98 Civic HX CVT

      Quote Originally Posted by jamerican1
      Dude, you know you're like the opposite of a purist, right?

    11. Geriatric Member Hostile's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:41 PM #86
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      I do. On a weekly basis. I manage the personal affairs of wealthy people for a living. I frequently need to drive to their house, ring the bell at their front gate (where they see me driving in my car), and then park in their front driveway. I need something that doesn't scream "LOOK AT ME, I"M A KID WHO LIKES BE RECKLESS AND DRIVE FAST."
      Frankly, I'm shocked you are even considering a lowly Subaru in the first place. Gotta project that panache to all your rich-ass clients!

      And beyond the badge, STI that is known to be stiff and generally less comfortable than its competition.

      If you do end up buying one, I guarantee you will be selling it within 6 months.

    12. Member kezho's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:45 PM #87
      Quote Originally Posted by Hostile View Post
      Frankly, I'm shocked you are even considering a lowly Subaru in the first place. Gotta project that panache to all your rich-ass clients!

      And beyond the badge, STI that is known to be stiff and generally less comfortable than its competition.

      If you do end up buying one, I guarantee you will be selling it within 6 months.
      This! While a great performance vehicle, a WRX/STi is too stiff and uncomfortable as a daily driver for my tastes.

    13. Member Slipstream's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:48 PM #88
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      In all seriousness, a 340 M-sport would fit pretty well here.

      Golf R works as I and others have stated.

      But if you want a performance car that needs to cut a low profile while still being bad-ass, there aren't a ton of options outside of that. Audi S3? S4? C43?
      Golf R and S3 really do seem like the best options if you want understated performance (and not BMW) for a reasonable price. Especially given the <$40k, 4 door, and manual requirements.

      Besides, VAG + Schnell = what could go wrong?
      08 c30 | 10 xc70 | seventwosix

    14. Member Elite_Deforce's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:48 PM #89
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      So basically the wing is about as useful as the rear brakes on a modern car. Might as well ditch them all for that clean look. Lulz



      Then I wouldn't get a WRX/STI or Focus RS, period.


      So I can't discount an entire brand for having crap interiors (Acura), but you can discount an entire car for one part that provides a marginal-at-best (not to mention delete-able from the factory!) performance benefit. Okay.
      Quote Originally Posted by puma1552 View Post
      obtuse.
      Well, at least you're self-aware.
      Last edited by Elite_Deforce; 04-17-2017 at 02:51 PM.
      Quote Originally Posted by Elite_Deforce View Post
      Panache, bruh.
      Quote Originally Posted by Ernie McCracken View Post
      I don't trust the judgment of anyone who likes black wheels.
      Quote Originally Posted by BRealistic View Post
      I find it ironic that long time Euro brand fans would assume long term reliability issues would destroy any love of a unique product.

    15. Member Ross1013's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 02:53 PM #90
      Quote Originally Posted by Hostile View Post
      Frankly, I'm shocked you are even considering a lowly Subaru in the first place. Gotta project that panache to all your rich-ass clients!

      And beyond the badge, STI that is known to be stiff and generally less comfortable than its competition.

      If you do end up buying one, I guarantee you will be selling it within 6 months.
      Yup

      Quote Originally Posted by Elite_Deforce View Post


      So I can't discount an entire brand for having crap interiors (Acura), but you can discount an entire car for one part that provides a marginal-at-best (not to mention delete-able from the factory!) performance benefit. Okay.
      You are literally too stupid to reply to. I'm saying if I were the OP and needed to impress rich clients and not look like a boy racer...I wouldn't be considering an STI or RS in the first place.

      Absolutely nothing to do with the wing argument, which was a completely separate point.
      Past: '06 Accord V6, '95 Taurus SHO, '01 ITR, '98 Civic HX CVT

      Quote Originally Posted by jamerican1
      Dude, you know you're like the opposite of a purist, right?

    16. Member
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      04-17-2017 02:56 PM #91
      Quote Originally Posted by Elite_Deforce View Post

      Well, at least you're self-aware.
      I don't know what your problem seems to be all the time. Not sure when you turned into such a douchebag.

    17. Member NoXenons's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 03:04 PM #92
      In4 the inevitable horrible dealership stories.
      Quote Originally Posted by RS-SIX View Post
      You guys are missing the point with manuals...not only does not one want to drive a manual, many active safety systems do not work with manual transmissions. Soon manual trans cars are going to be the most dangerous cars on the road. If they dont die a natural death, they will be outlawed.

    18. 04-17-2017 03:04 PM #93
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      I actually test drove one of these like 1.5 months ago when another TCLer bought one.

      The engine is a gem. But I really didn't like the way the car drove. It had the famous Q50 zero-feels steering. Didn't corner very flat. Not a huge fan of the looks of it.

      And my local dealer was being sheistery, so I would need to fly to CA to get one for a decent price. It just didn't win me over.

      But otherwise a good suggestion!
      Everyone I know who has tried one (because low lease rates) has come away saying the same thing - it's a price car. Great car when we're talking loaded GTI money, but it's really flawed for a lux car taken on it's merits.

      Which is why I renew my suggestion of any Charger 392. It's totally unique in the market, and it's a tasteful color away from that badass look you want. Here's another thought: It has universal appeal, especially to the older baby boomer crowd. It's a Hemi Charger for God's sake.





      It looks AWESOME in gray:



      One last point:

      We all know FCA reliability sucks. I know it, you know it, and I get the fear. Lease this car. And also, the holdover cars from DC (which this car definitely is) seem to be holding up better than the newer FCA cars. I would not chance anything on, say, a Dodge Dart or Chrysler 200.

      But this? Yeah....I would be willing to give one a go for 3 years. And the resale value means that if you get tired of it, you can likely sell it.
      Last edited by Maximum_Download; 04-17-2017 at 03:07 PM.
      Matt
      2016 Honda Accord Sport CVT w/ HondaSensing, Crystal Black Pearl/Black

    19. Member NoXenons's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 03:08 PM #94
      ^I don't see any baby boomers driving those. It's always urban people or 20-somethings.
      Quote Originally Posted by RS-SIX View Post
      You guys are missing the point with manuals...not only does not one want to drive a manual, many active safety systems do not work with manual transmissions. Soon manual trans cars are going to be the most dangerous cars on the road. If they dont die a natural death, they will be outlawed.

    20. Member Ross1013's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 03:10 PM #95
      @max_d: Didn't OP already say no domestics? That's why I didn't recommend the obvious choice of Chevy SS.

      Also, what NoXenons said. If I ever see an older muscle-car guy driving an SRT or HC, it's a 2-door.
      Last edited by Ross1013; 04-17-2017 at 03:13 PM.
      Past: '06 Accord V6, '95 Taurus SHO, '01 ITR, '98 Civic HX CVT

      Quote Originally Posted by jamerican1
      Dude, you know you're like the opposite of a purist, right?

    21. Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 03:15 PM #96
      Quote Originally Posted by kezho View Post
      This! While a great performance vehicle, a WRX/STi is too stiff and uncomfortable as a daily driver for my tastes.
      The only issue is that I commute a total of about 10k miles per year, and Las Vegas roads are generally brand new and smooth as glass (no snow/salt/potholes in the desert!). Also, stiff suspension doesn't bother me.

      And if I do end up selling the STI in 6-12 months? I probably won't take much of a bath on it. It's an STI, for god's sake. People sell these things for a pretty penny all the time.

      But I have not yet made up my mind.

      I will try a new 340i with the new B58 engine. My only issue with that car (and I know that this sounds totally pathetic), but it is so close to an M3, but also so far away. Additionally, on my 135i M-Sport, the "sport" suspension was so soft that I installed coilovers. I don't really want to be spending $1,000's in mods on a 340i just to get it where I want it.

    22. Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 03:17 PM #97
      Quote Originally Posted by Maximum_Download View Post
      Everyone I know who has tried one (because low lease rates) has come away saying the same thing - it's a price car. Great car when we're talking loaded GTI money, but it's really flawed for a lux car taken on it's merits.

      Which is why I renew my suggestion of any Charger 392. It's totally unique in the market, and it's a tasteful color away from that badass look you want. Here's another thought: It has universal appeal, especially to the older baby boomer crowd. It's a Hemi Charger for God's sake.





      It looks AWESOME in gray:



      One last point:

      We all know FCA reliability sucks. I know it, you know it, and I get the fear. Lease this car. And also, the holdover cars from DC (which this car definitely is) seem to be holding up better than the newer FCA cars. I would not chance anything on, say, a Dodge Dart or Chrysler 200.

      But this? Yeah....I would be willing to give one a go for 3 years. And the resale value means that if you get tired of it, you can likely sell it.
      I am also truly not sure whether FCA will sell me a car. I literally just sued them less than a year ago. I am almost positive that Chrysler Finance won't touch me, so leasing may be out of the question.

      The best option if I decide to go with a Charger might be to just get financing from my bank and pay cash at the dealer.

    23. Member Ross1013's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 03:20 PM #98
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      The best option if I decide to go with a Charger might be to just get financing from my bank and pay cash at the dealer.
      I'm sure that wouldn't get complicated at all.
      Past: '06 Accord V6, '95 Taurus SHO, '01 ITR, '98 Civic HX CVT

      Quote Originally Posted by jamerican1
      Dude, you know you're like the opposite of a purist, right?

    24. Member SchnellFowVay's Avatar
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      04-17-2017 03:22 PM #99
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      I'm sure that wouldn't get complicated at all.
      It's not super hard to do.

      But I don't think that I will end up with a Charger, either. But I am going to test drive one.

      A local dealer has a leftover 2016 392 that they are advertising huge mark-downs on. I may try to take that for a spin this coming Saturday.

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      04-17-2017 03:33 PM #100
      Quote Originally Posted by SchnellFowVay View Post
      I am also truly not sure whether FCA will sell me a car. I literally just sued them less than a year ago. I am almost positive that Chrysler Finance won't touch me, so leasing may be out of the question.

      The best option if I decide to go with a Charger might be to just get financing from my bank and pay cash at the dealer.
      Do you really think they keep a black list database that they cross reference every applicant through?

      FCA can't even build a good car, let alone make a customer sh!tlist...afterall, how many people that sue them ever bother going back to buy another anyway? Can't imagine they'd go to the effort to create such a database.

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